2/11

[cosmolinguist]

Some of the accounts break my heart. "I saw three bodies on the track. I couldn't look, it was so horrific. I think one was moving but I'm not too sure." "I've got glass in my hair and my pockets and my ear hurts." "A guy by me thought he was going to die, I'm hoping he got out OK." "I saw at least five people jump from the top deck of the bus. Half of it was blown away."

All of it, the mundane and the horrific, washing over me all at once.

One of the things the Internet does (or seems to do) is bring the pain of others to our living room--or bedroom, or office, or whatever--into our heads. "Oh, I'm so sorry," we say. "I wish I could help. Hugs." That feeling is all the worse today; I know I can't do anything for anybody.

I've heard now, I think, from all my friends in London. They're fine, woried about people and shaken up, but all in one piece. Well, they're not all in one big piece, they each get to be their own individual piece, a situation of which I'm sure they approve. And I hope those who made it to work or whatever wore sensible shoes today!

But I'm not exactly thrilled just because it doesn't involve anyone I know. That these things happen at all kept me jittery and weird longer than the initial shock warranted.

I read blurbs about things like suicide bombings in the news all the time--a dozen people or 31 or seven or whatever. It's always somewhere far away, somwhere where "you expect that kind of thing" ... and the people who live there expect it as well, which is too bad. There are places where everyone's been touched by this kind of senseless death; everyone has a story about parents, children, friends, neighbors, someone. That's no way to live.

And there are parts of the world where my own country is responsible for this, killing people who sell vegetables and mind their own business. And I can't do anything about any of that.

I worry that conservative politicians will use this as an excuse to further curtail the freedoms the British enjoy at this point. The US has given a wonderful example of what not to do, but I'm not too hopeful because I know there's not a vast difference between the current government of the UK and that of the US. And I can't do anything about that, either.

So what can I do?

While pondering this question, I go back to my favorite of hobbies, looking at my friends page. There, I see "I mean, I don't want to make light of anyone's tragedy today, but on the eleven scale this is a 2/11 at most, right?"

And I laugh. And I'm fine. I stop giggling and then start again. And I know London will be fine, too. I just read this about it:

The natural state of the English is a kind of gloomy diligence, which is why they do so well in hard times. In 1940, Londoners went dutifully on with their business while the Luftwaffe bombed the hell out of them. Today, most of them are doing the same. I was in Washington for 9/11, and the whole city went into a panic. Offices emptied, stores shut, downtown D.C. became a ghost town. But in London today, everyone still has a cell phone clutched to their ear. The delivery vans are still racing about, seeking shortcuts around all the street closures. The Starbucks is packed.

These are not the Londoners went through the Blitz, but this is the very same London. And they're still ready to make jokes and unwilling to make a fuss; I can't help but love them for that.

Comments

[mrs-fhqwhgads.livejournal.com]

I was just saying that to my mom- "you know blair's going to use this to try and push those id cards again"

thankfully everyone's smart enough to still say no. over here they'd acquiesce without even saying boo to the nearest goose. patriot act anyone?

[cosmolinguist]

When a friend of mine told me he was seeing pictures of Blair and Bush today, I said "Yeah, and Bush is probably leaning over to whisper "You got a Patriot Act ready?" And "Good thing we blew up Iraq, eh?" It seems to me that the Brits have a healthy measure of distrust for all things "patriotic"--they find flag-waving distasteful--though I still worry because my friends and other people I talk to are not the ones in charge of the country, and I know well that leaders can do things their constituents do not support.

[mrs-fhqwhgads.livejournal.com]

heh, I know- john mccain was on tv saying that it would strengthen british resolve for the war because "now they understand the dangers of terrorism from the middle east"- now john, I love you, but NO NO and NO! it'll just make the 91% who opposed the war even more opposed, because now people are dying for something they don't even like.

people keep comparing it to the blitz but it's not at all- people kept going then because they agreed they were doing something right, something GOOD, and they could handle losses and look forward. I highly doubt that any such sentiment is going to prevail...

hopefully blair is desperate enough to be loved that he backs down on id cards etc. when he realizes how utterly pissed everyone is going to be over this, once the effects wear off.

[cosmolinguist]

people keep comparing it to the blitz but it's not at all

I agree. I wonder if the fact that most USians don't realize what the IRA's been doing (and in most people's lifetimes, another thing you can't say about the Blitz) keeps them from making that good comparison and instead keep harping on the less-good one.

[mrs-fhqwhgads.livejournal.com]

heh, well, crispy was talking to dave about it and dave wondered if we didn't think about the IRA bombings as much because we were funding them- a good point...

we just like to pat the british on the back and say "well done" I think- it's not deliberate, we just kinda like them. even if it is hugely inappropriate

[rpkrajewski.livejournal.com]

My brother lives in Teddington, and he normally doesn't go into London, but just to make sure, I called, and he didn't even go into work today (sick day).

Given the fact that England and the continent have had to deal with actual terrorism (IRA, ultra-leftists, Palestinian extremists) since the late 60s, I wish the US had the same calm perspective on the security measures that need to be taken to deter and handle terrorist attacks.

[zboson.livejournal.com]

Our "security measures" in the US have nothing to do with terrorism. They just tell us that to keep us in line, to have us willingly surrender our civil liberties, unquestioningly. Actual security is just as poor as it's always been, frighteningly enough. Except now the US can arrest and detain immigrants for no reason, with no charges, and with no counsel, for an indefinite period of time! That's sure to prevent terrorism.

[rpkrajewski.livejournal.com]

That's pretty much about it. C'mon, we let a guy with a chainsaw in from Canada (at Calais, Maine) just about a month ago.

[zboson.livejournal.com]

Yeah, a bloody chainsaw, no less. But he was a citizen of the US, so he's a-ok in our books.

It's the immigrants you have to watch out for.

Immigrants like me, whom they are currently trying to deport for a minor arrest seven years ago. I wasn't even convicted of anything. But the way they make it sound, you'd think I strapped bombs to infants and threw them at the President. I have a file a foot thick, with my DNA in it and all.

[zdover.livejournal.com]

What'd they say you did?

[zboson.livejournal.com]

The terrible crime of smoking the marijuana. I know, I know, I should have America's boot in my ass on my way out.

[zboson.livejournal.com]

Yes, London's been through so much, and the noble old city stands yet. It's almost incredible how long that city's been there and the ridiculous amount of horror it's seen. There's not much that could perturb a city like that, now, is there?

What I don't like is the way every tragedy that happens now has to be measured against the yardstick of 9/11. If fewer people died than in 9/11, then it's not really much of a tragedy, and so, what's the big deal, right? If more people die, then it's okay to get upset (such as the tsunami), because it is a tragedy. Well, eff that. It's a f*cking tragedy if one person dies. At least in a natural disaster or accident there isn't a concentrated ill behind it, a human malevolence and desire to inflict suffering. That's what makes this a tragedy, too - not just the fact that people died, but the fact that other people did it, on purpose, to make them suffer. THAT is the goddamned tragedy, that people can be so evil to each other.

Maybe I'm too sensitive. I cried over the news this morning. What with the world being the horrific place it is, there's no room for that kind of sentimentality. People die. People kill each other. Ho hum.

[cosmolinguist]

What I don't like is the way every tragedy that happens now has to be measured against the yardstick of 9/11

I called my mom (I knew she'd be worried if I didn't, even though I've repeatedly made the point that I'm not anywhere near London (a point made necessary by the fact that everyone I know in the US seems to think that "London" and "England" are equivalent terms)) and she kept talking about 9/11. It irritated me, but didn't surprise me. USians have been taught by their media to connect everything to that. Last summer she was worried about me being here because she heard about terrorists in Russia holding a school hostage, and she didn't even listen when I explained they were Chechen terrorists and it had nothing at all to do with Iraq or Al Qaida or anything like that. To her it was just "terrorism," and all terrorism is the same. It's too bad people think that way, though.

I cried over the news this morning.

I nearly did. It hit me, for some reason, harder than ... well, sorry to compare them again :-) but 9/11, which I'm sure would surprise some people because that was an attach on "my" country. On Our Own Soil, as I remember hearing so often. But for some reason--maybe that I know people in that town? maybe I just feel more connected to London than New York or DC, neither of which I've been much less than 1000 miles from? maybe that I've been alone and unable to distract myself all day?--this bothered me more.

[zboson.livejournal.com]

Yes, well, I do know what you mean. It's easy to watch the news and see people being blown away in say, Israel, and think, how sad, and then forget and continue about your day. Even the tsunami was easy to distance oneself from for a lot of us. But when 9/11 happened I remember I cried literally all day, and to this day cannot discuss what happened because I get too emotional. Is it because I live in NYC, I saw the buildings burning? I don't know, but it affected me on some deep, subconscious level, for whatever reason. It was when I saw the streetsigns, I saw the name of the street where I work, covered in ash... I lost it.

But with London I'm the same way, I'm very torn up over this. That's because I've been to London a few times, I guess - I adore it. I have friends there. I don't know. I just keep thinking about it and crying some more, like a damned fool.

Yes, I agree, 9/11 has become iconic in the world of terror. It's the terror superstar against which all other terror must compete. Leave it to the US to have the best terror attack so far. Everything is glitzy here; the streets are paved with gold. TV cameras caught it all, forever and ever burned into the retinas of audiences the world over.

[j4.livejournal.com]

somwhere where "you expect that kind of thing"

I'd put London in that category, to be honest -- there have been many, many terrorist attacks there, and it's hardly surprising really; the capital city is always an obvious target for anybody wanting to attack a country (or even just wanting to cause maximum disruption).

And they're still ready to make jokes

Hmmm, some of the people who've followed up to verlaine's post seem to disagree...

But yes. Life does go on. It has to.

[cosmolinguist]

...some of the people who've followed up to verlaine's post seem to disagree.

I'm sure they will. Not everyone has that sense of humor, in this country or any other. (This is my other good example of that for today.) But that it exists at all makes it this country remarkably different from, say, my own. Humor, without losing respect where it's due, is a great benefit.

Oh, and I forgot...

[cosmolinguist]

I'd put London in that category, to be honest

Yeah, I agree. I've heard that Manchester got some of its shiny new buildings thanks to the IRA blowing up the old ones. While not being nonchalant about this sort of thing, the English have managed to deal with it graciously. If the point of terrorism is really to cause terror, surely London is a stupid place to go about it, because you won't get a very satisfying reaction. This entry said all that very well, as did this one.

[zboson.livejournal.com]

The natural state of the English is a kind of gloomy diligence, which is why they do so well in hard times. In 1940, Londoners went dutifully on with their business while the Luftwaffe bombed the hell out of them. Today, most of them are doing the same. I was in Washington for 9/11, and the whole city went into a panic. Offices emptied, stores shut, downtown D.C. became a ghost town. But in London today, everyone still has a cell phone clutched to their ear. The delivery vans are still racing about, seeking shortcuts around all the street closures. The Starbucks is packed.

I have to point out, also, that 9/11 and this event are very, very different. The scale is much smaller here. They were bombs, not hijacked aircraft. There's a reason why DC emptied out and yet London just carries on, and it's not because Londoners are harder people than DCers. In the US we actually thought for several hours that the entire country was under a attack, meaning war. Four planes were hijacked and one of them was aimed at the Pentagon. That's a HELL of a different thing than bombs under commuter trains, sorry. I'm not making light of what happened today, though.

[cosmolinguist]

No, it's a good point, especially as we were just saying they're different. I admit that the guy (or girl? ::looks:: guy) is skewing things a bit there. But I also think there is a point to be made there; mrs_fhqwhgads makes it better, though, in one of her recent posts:

something bad but not on the same scale, like the power outage the other year, caused looting and mentalism all around. I always maintain that the british are less frantic than americans, for whatever reasons, and this seems to be fairly good proof.

[zboson.livejournal.com]

I don't know, I lived through the NE power outage and actually there wasn't "looting and mentalism all around". In fact there were barbeques, street parties, people handing out free ice-cold water to weary foot-travelers in the 90-degree heat. Maybe it's because I live in NYC, and New Yorkers are a seasoned lot, but more I think it's a matter of perspective. I'm not even American (Canadian, of solid 100% British stock), but I've lived here for nine years, and I have to say, Americans are very harshly judged by everyone else. I've never found them to be "frantic" at all (especially not in the South, where I lived for five of my nine years). But having never lived in England I have no way to compare. Perhaps the English are an exceptionally laid-back group.

What I do know is that we live under the colour-coded "terror alert" system here. Our government actively generates fear among the populace, for reasons of control. You can't blame people for thinking the worst when little things happen. It's been an ongoing brainwashing program. After a while it gets to you. Some of us have just shut off completely, totally ignoring the "terror" alerts and warnings they hand out like greeting cards on every holiday and event. Others have taken it to heart and live in a state of perpetual fear. Immigrants have it the worst because they are singled out and threatened, treated like their immigration status makes them all potential terrorists or criminals. Our borders are locked up like Swiss banks. You can't even get in the country now without being photographed and fingerprinted, preemptively taking care of those things just in case you get any fancy ideas. So yes, of course, this makes some people a little nervous, a little jittery and on edge, but as a whole, I don't think so. Not yet, anyway.

[cosmolinguist]

To some degree it depends on what you've experienced, and where you live, and how you perceive things. My mom has a much worse view of humanity as a whole than I do, but then she's steeped in the Midwest, and she's old enough to remember when the media was more trustworthy and maybe that's why she believes everything she hears on TV. But I do agree it's the government and the media causing most of the trouble.

[zboson.livejournal.com]

Hahaha, speaking of which, my TV show has been interrupted by a Special News Report - a live press conference of the mayor and the governor talking about how NYC is on "high alert" now and all the subways are going to have k-9 units and extra security blah blah blah. Because you know, the terrorists are on a plane on their way over from London AS WE SPEAK. And they're bringing bombs to strap into subway cars. Hence the "orange alert"! (Whatever that means.) The words "war on terror" were spoken about 4834786534 times.

It's all a crapload of propaganda.

[cosmolinguist]

It always irritated me when, periodicaly through the part four years, there have been times the adminstration said we should be on high alert because, oh, it was September eleventh again, or because of the election, or all these other dates they saw as being obvious for an attack. I always thought "God, that's stupid. You think they're going to pick the obvious dates? Oh, yeah, like they did with 9/11. That was such a famous date, a momentous occasion. Surprise is part of the whole point. So it's stupid--if inevitable--that they'd make a big deal out of how this is definitely going to happen again, in one day.

[kmusser]

http://www.livejournal.com/community/metaquotes/3467837.html

[cosmolinguist]

That's true! The Daleks are much scarier.

[(Anonymous)]

I'm glad you called your mother. I'm glad you are ok. I know that England and London aren't the same thing, but I can't think of contingencies that would place you in London.

[victorxman.livejournal.com]

Oh that was me... thought I was logged in...

[cosmolinguist]

That's all right; I've done it myself. Thanks for identifying yourself eventually.

[cosmolinguist]

That one's got to be sarcastic hasn't it?

Well, it's really on the BBC site, along with the rest. As to whether it's sarcastic or not I couldn't say. When I first started pulling snatches of that page out to list in my entry, I chose that because I thought it was interesting and I thought it was interesting precisely because it seemed very trivial in comparison with some of the horror and chaos ... but that really is the worst that's happened to some people; it's part of the experience. The little things don't stop just because there's a local tragedy. Also, it is from a teenager, which may imply a certain self-centeredness as well...

[zboson.livejournal.com]

Sometimes when people are in shock they don't make a whole lot of sense. The full horror hasn't really sunk in yet. For some people it doesn't come 'til later.

[quuf.livejournal.com]

You're so right about that wonderful resilience. I remember well the words of my favorite aunty, who served in the forces all through the war: We've had our backs against the wall before!

[(Anonymous)]

You were the first person I thought of when I heard the news. Having no idea where you were in jolly old England, I just sent the best juju I could toward you and Andrew.

Glad to know you're okay, and that everyone you know over there is okay, too...

[cosmolinguist]

Thanks, dude. I'm actually mystified at who I could know who knows I'm here and knows about my journal who doesn't have one themselves, so thanks for the bit of intrigue as well. :-)

[classytart.livejournal.com]

I'm playing major catch-up on my friends page, so haven't read the comments. Apologies if I repeat anyone.

The thing with London (and English - and I do mean English here - cities in general) is that it's only fairly recently that they don't get bombed by the IRA on a semi-regular basis. Certainly in my lifetime it's not that long.

IRA bombings were never common enough that everyone had a story, or that people got complacent, but a bomb was never a terrible shock. The deaths were always horrible, but that there was a bomb was not in itself shocking. Not expected. Not waited-for. But not truly shocking.

So I think we'll be OK. I don't think TB will go bombing other countries.

Though there is the increased risk of ID cards. Because lord knows that no-one with an ID card would EVER do a thing like that. Just not cricket, deal chap.

[cosmolinguist]

I think the first or second day I was in Manchester stealthmunchkin and I were in Piccadilly Station and I had some bit of garbage and was looking around so I could throw it away. Andrew told me not to bother. "There are no bins here." I made a face, thinking that was weird, and he explained "It's so people don't put bombs in them." Then I made a weirder face and he explained further that the IRA had done that once or something. And he was rather nonchalant about this, which of course stunned little old American me. Not that he was being careless about Human Life Lost, because I don't think he was, but just that such a thing could be spoken of casually. It was one of the first times it really hit me that, even though I can understand the language (sometimes!) this is definitely a foreign country.

And yes, much was said yesterday--maybe not in the comments here, I don't remember, but some places--about how similar this is to the sorts of things the IRA did, and how tough London is. I'm glad everyone will bounce back, and I certainly hope that Blair doesn't decide to bomb any more countries than he already is. Many people have mentioned the ID cards as well and--being as how they're all my friends, and thus sensible--they all wonder what good it'll do, unless the baddies put "Terrorist" down for their Occupation.

[acoustic-riff.livejournal.com]

"And there are parts of the world where my own country is responsible for this, killing people who sell vegetables and mind their own business."

Sadly this is true, it does happen. But to say its similar to what happened today is not right, its not even close.

[cosmolinguist]

It doesn't seem all that different, to me. This admistration, in its infinite wisdom, have decided to terrorize Afghans and Iraqis. I think the only difference is that we're doing it on a larger scale, and continuously.

[acoustic-riff.livejournal.com]

Frankly I find that insulting,. I haven't agreed with everything that has been done with in the "War on Terror" but I don't think almost 2,000 US soliders have died in order to terrorize people, they did so to defend their country against the enemies that want us dead (that would kill you and everyone you know for their supposed "cause" and not blink.)

What happened in London, Madrid, and New York were acts of incredible evil - the deliberate murder of innocent people. Do you really believe the United States of America has done the same thing?

[cosmolinguist]

Do you think the United States of America can't be doing the same thing--or can't have the same word used about them--just because the government and the military are doing this and thus it's legitimate?

We're not at war with Iraq; we invaded them. It's not their military we're fighting (we're supposed to be "helping" them), it's not their government because we instituted that (such as it is now). The US is fighting "insurgents," who look surprisingly like everybody else.

Mnay ordinary people--who quite possibly didn't like the old regime but couldn't do much about it, who don't like this one but change it either--have died. I don't know how many; we're not even counting them. And I don't suppose they end up on Dan Rather's little "Fallen Heroes" segment of the news like the US soldiers do.

I'm sure I've been even more insulting now ... but, you did ask.

[acoustic-riff.livejournal.com]

They are not doing the same thing. Yes innocent people have died, and that is a terrible thing. But the US isn't trying to kill innocent people.

We are helping in Iraq, helping them to rebuild after getting rid of their murderous leader and his cronies. Not everyone their agrees with it, and yes the US screwed up the post invasion plan (I agree it was an invasion, and done under false pretenses). But some of those who disagree want to kill US soilders and innocent people and have done so in multitudes. Are we not suppose to try to stop them? Are those sucide bombings, downed helicopters, and beheaded hostages ok? In order to create some semblence of peace the mostly non-Iraqi Insurgents have to be dealt with.

[cosmolinguist]

But some of those who disagree want to kill US soilders and innocent people and have done so in multitudes.

But you think we could do a little better separating those people from the others. The one attack on the US ("killing innocent people") wasn't perpetrated by Iraqis. Not even by their government, and certainly not by the fruit-sellers and other normal people we tend to accidentally hit from time to time. Fallujah was one of the most peaceful cities in the country just after the fall of Saddam, until coalition soldiers started shooting protestors there (while suffering no casualties themselves). Stuff like that happens all the time, and it sucks.

That was my point. Everyone says someone "needs to be dealt with." Everyone says someone else started it. And I don't see how it'll change when we all keep thinking this, and that's why I felt so helpless yesterday and wrote about this in the first place.

[toastedtuna.livejournal.com]

I'm so THRILLED you're OK! When I heard about this, you were the first person to enter my mind. "What about Holly? Is she OK? OMG, I hope she and Andrew were home today!!!"

I'm glad you're able to laugh about the 2/11 joke. On some other day, I might have found it funny, but today I'm just worried about everyone and their families.

[cosmolinguist]

When I heard about this, you were the first person to enter my mind.

Aw, thanks. A handful of others also expressed concern for me (and I called my mom to reassure her; I knew I had to, even though I was nowhere near anything bad that happened, because moms are like that), and it's sweet.

I'm glad you're able to laugh about the 2/11 joke. On some other day, I might have found it funny, but today I'm just worried about everyone and their families.

If you click on the link there you'd see that verlaine actually got tons of crap from people who thought he was being insensitive. I'm glad he stuck up for himself and pointed out that he wasn't saying that these deaths are less important or anything, just that it was actually a much smaller-scale attack ... which it was. Yesterday I heard there were something like 33 dead and one or two hundred in the hospital. Horrible, indeed, for those concerned and their families, but not as bad as 9/11. Which I'm sure he thinks is A Good Thing. I'm glad he stuck up for humor in the face of pain and tragedy; death is weird, random, scary, inevitable ... the best thing we can do is laugh about it. And, of course, my sympathies are still with those involved and their loved ones.